2014 Versa Note SV, just got!

Discussion in 'Nissan' started by RoadWarrior222, Jul 11, 2014.

  1. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    Yes it's spinning the engine, RPM remain about 1100, but you can't feel the drag, it feels like a neutral coast does in other cars. It has Variable Valve timing on both cams so it's gotta be closing all the valves up when it does that, killing the pumping loss.

    Well, in the city I'm not getting to use the full coast down from 30-15mph distance anyway. But I'm thinking at idle it would be sucking about 3l/100. I believe it has lockup as long as you are coasting, so you don't go wasting it in the torque converter, so going out of drive and back in again, you'd be a couple of seconds before it locked up again probably, if you needed to give it another push.

    Need to look up whether it runs the transmission lube pump in neutral, if it does, no worries, if it doesn't, don't neutral coast.
     
  2. PaleMelanesian

    PaleMelanesian Beat the System Staff Member

    1100 rpm is pretty good. My Odyssey holds whatever rpm it was, 2000 or so, which is a LOT of pumping loss on a 3.5 V6. My Fit with its low geared manual is even worse, but I go in to neutral anyway.

    Transmission lube pump is usually run by the engine, so unless you're coasting engine-off, it's fine. What does it do when you (generic you, of course ;)) idle it in a parking lot? I'm sure the pump is running then.
     
  3. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    They do.
     
  4. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    that reads as a bit of a derp, what I mean is that rolling at about 25mph, put into idle, it would use about that.

    Just trying to get a better spitball of how much you lose when idling when stopped, I'm figuring it is burning at about the rate of the lowest steady state you'll see which is something like 2.2 @ 25mph, was probably thinking 3l for AC on. Anyway, lets convert that to time... 25=~40kph.. 100km = 2.5 x 40 so 2.5 hours to burn 2.2 litres... so we're prollabubbly around a litre an hour burn. maybe litre and half for AC.

    Didn't fill up yet, will have to this morn. Had the drive from hell across the city last night at 5, every idiot in the universe was on the road... you know blocking 4 lanes of traffic doing a U turn... dozing off when the light turned green, so only 2 cars got through that kind of crap.... every opportunity anyone had to steal my momentum, they did*, and it seemed I lost 1/8 of a tank to do 7 miles, in half an hour, av speed 14mph... gah do as good on a bike.... average didn't budge off 5.4 but before I started the range remaining was ~200km and after it was at ~80. Last time I filled at that point, 2 bars showing, ~80km range remaining, and it took 34litres, so still about 6 left, not sure if reserve included.

    (* You know, pulling out 30ft ahead of you, so you have to slam on the brakes then crawling for 2 blocks at 20mph or less with an empty road ahead of them, if you're in such a freaking hurry to be in front of me, BE IN MORE OF A HURRY.)
     
  5. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    Doing some errands this morning. Had the GPS on/programmed... actually rather helpful for assessing how far you have available to coast. It does about 200 meters to drop from 25mph/40kph to 15mph/20kph.

    Damn thing kept jumping into "range anxiety mode" 80km left ... 74km left.. then last number I saw was 64.. then it went to - - - - ... verrry helpful, especially when you won't let me see instant, so you know, I could hypermile the hell out of it to get to a gas station.. (If I didn't know I was only a kilometer from one) ... I suspected it still had about 6 litres in at this point and was still showing 2 bars on the gauge.

    Filled up, 601.3 km 34.4 liters. long term av showing 5.4l/100 so about 41.5 mpg actual, nearly 44mpg indicated, so the average is 0.2 to 0.3 off. Reset the average at the gas station this time, just hold button to clear like the trip odo. Home was a short city drive away of course, but it's a shallow uphill all the way, so indicated 6.2 av by the time I got here from gas station.

    Edit: Just thought of the possibility that it only records l/100 when you're actually moving and doesn't take account of idle time.

    EditII: Just pondering where I might have been but for that bad city grind last night. Showing 4 bars on gas gauge, think there's 20 bars total, so about 2l per bar, used 2 bars, so 4l short for about 20km so on 580km/30.4l I would have been at about 45mpg ..... though of course gas gauges are rarely that accurate. (Guessing there's a 2l reserve after last bar, that's pretty standard practice)
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2014
  6. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    OMG the idiots from yesterday carried over into today this afternoon. Had to do several city runs, and they were in full swing again, trying to turn right from left lane, waving pedestrians across on a green light when it's a short light and they get their own damn light. Raining also, which makes pedestrians behave suicidal, i.e. "I know that it's extra hard for vehicles to see me and stop in heavy rain, so since I'd rather die than get any wetter I'll just run across the road whenever..." Clue required for 3 vehicles at least today... when your GPS says make a U-turn as soon as possible, it means as soon as safely possible... Stood the car on it's nose several times to avoid a-holes. Swerved violently at least twice.... was awake and paying attention enough to ride out a dozen "would have beens" due to spotting idiots early.... By the end of the afternoon I was giving everyone the laser eye and practically chewing the wheel. If I was driving a large truck to the exact letter of the law as regards right of way etc, I'd have collected quite a few hood ornaments. I thought I didn't get road respect in my Escort Wagon, I guess I actually did, the amount due to something that looks old enough they don't care who they hit, I'm getting none in a shiny new looking small car, they figure I'll chicken first. Wasted a bunch of gas in brake and tire wear.... So yah, average showing now is 7.5l/100 about right on the EPA city... not many km though so rest of week will drop that.
     
  7. MaxxMPG

    MaxxMPG Hasta Lavista AAA-Vee Von't Be Bach

    The "day from hell" you describe is something we all experience in congested areas. Needing to brake suddenly is something that becomes far less frequent when you DWB - "Drive With Buffers" (also Driving Without Brakes) - with a good four second buffer ahead and always looking three lights ahead for changing traffic. Idiots will always be there to swerve in front of you, and a healthy buffer ahead will minimize the risk of having to take serious evasive action to avoid a collision. My pet peeve is the phone chatters - accelerate to 20 over the limit and then brake and drift among the lanes and over the center line... With a four second buffer, their dangerous and wasteful pulse-and-brake has little effect on me. Even when a moron cuts ahead of me, seeing an opening as the phone chatter accelerates only to have to stand on his brakes when the chatter brakes, I adjust the buffer as the moron cuts in since I know what's coming next. Hypermiling techniques to require more attention to the road as you need to watch this symphony of idiocy unfolding in front of you and also watch the lights to know when a stale green ahead indicates the need for a fuel-cut glide or a NICE-on if it's further ahead.
     
  8. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    Yah, driving with buffers is somewhat natural to me, but that's what tends to make people think there's enough space to pull out into or people pound up from behind, swerve around you into your buffer and slam on their brakes, because they didn't realise you were slowing because traffic was slowing.... seriously get a lot of people only react to whats 20ft ahead of them here... it can get to the point that you're using more gas "defending" a large buffer than it saves you.... and you might say "why defend, just back off more"... doesn't work, you'd end up stopped. It's a weird mix we've got here too, it's not 100% aggressive traffic that knows where they're going like you'd get in a big city on a weekday... it's a large proportion of that and a crap load of wild card dilberts that don't have a clue where they're going, are taken unawares by such novelties as advance greens and right turn on red. Then there's a sprinkling of retirees who drive like the world owes them their life. The aggressive lot react to these in various ways, like keeping the right pedal down and swerving around into your lane, braking is for other people. Seriously a few hundred yard stretch near any of the larger intersections could keep a team of 10 traffic cops busy writing up infractions non-stop. Then unhelpful is a bunch of "nice" people who cede their right of way unpredictably and in the most frustrating circumstances for everyone behind/around them.* Which also encourages the aggressive a-holes to demand that right of way is ceded from others.

    * And by that I'm not meaning just the simple let someone else merge that costs you a fraction of a second, I'm talking more of coming to a bizarre unexpected halt and managing to stall 4 lanes of traffic, maybe stall all 4 ways of an intersection, while the person being waved on figures out they they are being let in unexpectedly, and check around to make sure it's actually safe, because the waver is still rolling slowly and might take off any second, and there's traffic creeping around that won't stop... yes you can see a "well meaning" person bring a substantial part of the city to a complete halt for 2 or 3 minutes at a time... especially if they are frantically waving someone to turn into a street that's already blocked with no traffic moving, and they finally subside and "park" themselves across the intersection... until that traffic moves. (I know a-holes will do that given opportunity anyway).

    Anyway, yah, avoidance of this lot is the better strategy, but there's only so many side streets you can dodge round before you have to go through one of the choke points.
     
  9. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    Hmmm wife is leadfooting it all week, not expecting to see much off 6l/100

    Found something that I can't get at, exact same motor, BSFC vs RPM graphs, drool drool
    http://eprints2.utem.edu.my/5383/

    It's not in the preview. That merely whets the appetite. Can anyone figure out how to get to it?
     
  10. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    Well the gauge went down to 5.9/100 but the actual came in around 6.4l/100 ~36mpg, I really don't think it's accounting for idle, because there was a lot of idle in those godawful city thrashes.... Wife probably didn't do all that bad. She's taken it away for the weekend now, that is a long highway trip so interested to see what it fills at next time. Can't find receipt right now to log the tank properly.

    So yah, back to the Escort for a couple of trips after getting thoroughly used to the Note.... holy crap, I had this thing set up to roll well compared to anybody elses car I ever drove but still I was getting out of it every few blocks to see if I was running on flat tires it feels so draggy in comparison to Note. Also yes, definitely noticed "beater respect" again... For instance, when there is obstruction on other side of the road, parked cars etc. You know the right of way is with the side of the road that DOESN'T have the obstruction, but if there's larger (private) vehicles coming in opposite direction, I can actually take my legal right of way in the Escort, they flinch, wait like they are supposed to. In the Note, I either have to hit the brakes hard or go on the shoulder.


    Edit: Heh, just a thought, the VW crowd didn't come up with rusty hood decals yet did they?
     
  11. xcel

    xcel PZEV, there's nothing like it :) Staff Member

    Hi RoadWarrior:

    Let us try and get you ready to tackle the inner city since that is where you appear to take it on the chin.

    You are not there to defend the buffer. You collapse it when they have stopped ahead and expand it when the wave accelerates. Someone cuts in during the glide/buffer crush, rebuild it.

    Look ahead 1/2 of km to anticipate what the pack will do and allow the car to comingle with that knowledge at maximum FE.

    IHTHs?

    Wayne
     
  12. RoadWarrior222

    RoadWarrior222 rockit serjun

    Yah, I haven't got the arterial boulevards like some (better planned) big cities have here, it's short scrappy blocks, ~1/8 mile, so that's as realistically far as I can plan. Also no timed lights for predictable waves. i.e. you won't get several blocks at once in a timed wave, they're all sensor triggered... and if there's enough traffic to keep them triggered every cycle, they are in a random synch.

    What I'm saying is I typically get very little use out of the buffers I make, not that it's costing to make them, but it's an exercise in frustration.

    Now if we had some minimal grudging adherence to sensible rules of the road here, I'd find it a heck of a lot easier to read the road a bit further up, even when it's not moving allowing some engine off. But since a lot of the holdups seem reasonless due to somebody doing something strange, and then finally letting traffic move again, the stops seem to come unpredictably, as do the starts, don't often have the couple of seconds grace to restart manually. Well I could take it anyway, but that would make me as much of a dick as most of the drivers I'm complaining about.
     
  13. EdwinTheMagnificent

    EdwinTheMagnificent Legend In His Mind

    I worry a whole lot less about that than I did five years ago. When I'm in the right hand lane, I accelerate at MY pace , I take my foot off the gas and go in neutral when EYE want to. If the road is only one lane in each direction , I will go close to the speed limit , but I still accelerate at my pace and go into a glide when it suits me.

    If they don't like it they can pass me on the shoulder. Or sidewalk.
     

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